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Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

03-22-2004 19:42 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

      citat od BiH:


    ...

    Ovo je u najmanju ruku diskutabilno 18.gif Ako idemo tom logikom onda isto tako postoji vjerovatnoca da kada tornado predje preko otpada napravi bez icije pomoci auto, avion ili nesto slicno.Vjerovatnoca da se ovo desi takodje je veca od nule, jer predpostavljam da na na tom smetljistu (deponiji) imaju vec sve sirovine koje su potrebne za jedan automobil.
    Budi iskren pa reci da li vjerujes da se ovo moze desiti ili ti je to vise nalik na bajku. 01.gif


Care moj

vjerovatnoca je broj koji dobijes kada podjelis broj povoljnih dogadjaja (da tornado napravi avion) sa brojem svih mogucih dogadjaja (kombinacija koje se mogu dobiti od dijelova na otpadu), pa ako ti znas da imas sve dijelove za avion, i ako tornado moze uraditi sve one procese ukljucene u pravljenju aviona, onda vjerovatnoca za to postoji.

Ti ne kontas da postoje neki zakoni koje ti i ja ne mozemo mijenjati ni shvatati na svoj nacin. Nije do tebe i do mene da odredimo je li kretanje haoticno ili ne; postoje neka pravila koja sve to definisu.

Ja bih ti preporucio da uzmes one knjige koje ti vise leze (mislim religiozne), i da pokusas sebe naci i shvatiti potrebu nekih ljudi za religijom. Islamu i Kuranu ne trebaju falsifikati nauke da bi ucvrstili vjeru vjernika. Onaj koji vjeruje zna sto vjeruje, a vi sto ne znate moracete naci pravi put do toga. Ovaj tvoj je pogresan jer je tvoje znanje plitko.

Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

03-21-2004 05:35 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

      citat od BiH:

    Hvala na odgovoru airuno, ali ne bih se mogao sloziti s tobom. Citajuci pazljivo tvoj zadnji post, ne mogu a da ne kazem da je nelogican. Cime potkrepljujes tezu da je kretanje nebeskih tijela neharmonicno. Sta za tebe predstavlja haos?
      Zakoni fizike (znani i neznani) su ti koji uticu na kretanja nebeskih tijela, i recimo ako naidje neka velika kometa koja se pojavljuje jednom u 4 milijarde godina, moze se desiti da od ove nase harmonije malo toga ostane.

    A sta ako ne naidje? A cak i ako naidje moze li se to nazvati haosom 14.gif Jednom u cetiri milijarde godina 21.gif



BiH,

cini mi se da ne kontas sta sam ti htio reci. Zamisli neku kruznicu precnika 1 km. Onda zamisli jedan mali djelic te kruznice, recimo duzine 10cm. Taj djelic ti izgleda kao jedna prava linija, jer je zanemarljivo mali u odnosu na duzinu kruznice, a u stvari je dio luka, tj. zakrivljen je. To je razlika izmedju globalnog i lokalnog.

Sada ovo primjeni na kretanje nebeskih tijela, pa pokusaj shvatiti da je nemoguce izracunati uticaj svih nebeskih tijela i kosmickih sila jednih na druge. Sva kretanja sto se ne mogu matematicki opisati, tj predstaviti nekom matematickom jednacinom, ili barem aproksimirati, predstavljaju haoticna kretanja. Ti mozda ne osjetis uticaj neke supernove, ali taj uticaj na neka bliska nebeska tijela je ogroman. A posto je sve to nemoguce za predvidjeti (barem nama ljudima, danas), to je vise neki haos nego harmonija.

Sto se tice one knjige, ono je cisti supljak. Nedostaju dokazi, experimenti i tvrdnje tamo navedene su uglavnom pogresne. Onaj site je i napravljen za ljude koji nisu zainteresovani da zagrebu malo dublje. Ako te evolucija zaista zanima, vrati se nekoliko stranica unazad na ovoj temi, pa ces naci interesantna objasnjenja i preporuke o jako dobrim knjigama.

Sto se tice formiranja proteina i slucajnosti...Ne vidim kako ti ovo istrazivanje dokazuje da je zivot morao biti smisljeni produkt jedne inteligencije. Zato sto je vjerovatnoca slucajnosti mala? I slucajnost, inace, kako je to definisana u ovome kontekstu, pod kojim to tacno uslovima je nemoguce? Treba da znas da je statistika nauka kojom se moze sve dokazati.

Ako je vjerovatnoca mala, to ne znaci da je nesto nemoguce. Mozda ne znas da je vjerovatnoca 0<=P<=1, a izmedju 0 i 1 ima beskonacno mnogo brojeva. U ostalom, i trebalo je samo jednom da se desi da bi zivot poceo, ostalo je stvar evolucije. To sto je vjerovatnoca mala, ne znaci nista sve dok je veca od nule. 01.gif

Ako ti se da citati, evo ti nesto o haoticnom kretanju:

    http://geosys.mit.edu/~solar/text/short.html

Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

03-20-2004 11:21 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

      citat od BiH:

    ...
    I ako mozes odgovori mi da li se nebeska tijela krecu haoticno ili organizovano.


Izvini, zaboravih da ti odgovorim na ovo pitanje (mada sam ga vec odgovorio u jednom ranijem postu na ovoj temi). Kretanje nebeskih tijela u globalu je haoticno. Ako gledas lokalno, npr. suncev sistem, mozes reci da su putanje manje-vise matematicki definisane i da je to "organizovano" kretanje, kako ga ti nazivas. Medjutim ako bi se gledalo kroz jedan duzi period, od recimo 4 milijarde godina, vrlo je tesko reci da je to "organizovano" kretanje. Zakoni fizike (znani i neznani) su ti koji uticu na kretanja nebeskih tijela, i recimo ako naidje neka velika kometa koja se pojavljuje jednom u 4 milijarde godina, moze se desiti da od ove nase harmonije malo toga ostane.

Sto se tice ove knjige, ako se nadje vremena ...

Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

03-20-2004 06:20 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

      citat od BiH:

    Airuno, ja nisam ni tvrdio da sve znam nego sam pitao da li ima neko od strucnjaka da kaze svoje misljenje. I bice mi drago da naucim nesto novo, pa bih te zamolio da mi das link za ovo istrazivanje od NASA-e ako ga imas. Ne zelim biti kao papagaj i primiti sve zdravo za gotovo i onda to trubiti ovdje po forumu. Zato bih volio cuti misljenje onih koji znaju vise od mene u vezi sa stvaranjem proteina, o cemu je ranije bilo pisano.
    Volio bih cuti tvoje misljenje o kretanju nebeskih tijela-da li je haoticno ili organizovano.
    Kazes da skrecem temu na tumacenje Kur'ana. Pa upravo mislim da je Kur'an jedan od najvecih, ako ne i najveci, dokaz Bozjeg postojanja. Nemam nista protiv da oni koji znaju napisu nesto i iz drugih svetih kniga. Ako si pazljivo citao vidio si da je Kenzo upravo trazio ajete i njihovo tumacenje. Ako to raji smeta ja cu prestati 10.gif



BiH, ne kazem da svak treba sve znati, vec kazem da ne znamo svi isto, pa neke stvari koje su nekome trivijalne, drugome izgledaju kao cudo. Mene kada nesto interesuje, ja potrazim odgovore iz vise razlicitih izvora informacija. Ti ovdje trazis odgovore na pitanja koja su uglavnom obradjena u prirodnim naukama, a kao svoj izvor argumenata koristis Kuran. Mislim da to nije bas kompatibilno.

Sto se tice onog linka:
    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2001/01/010131074526.htm


A sad molim te pogledaj ovu dole sliku i samo pokusaj zamisliti planetu Zemlju, a onda pokusaj zamisliti koliki dio ovoga prostora je obradjen u Kuranu... (ovo su galaksije, a ne zvijezde)

Pokusaj isto tako zamisliti da su neke religije stare 20 000 godina. I razmisli o tome zasto su prije ljudi imali boga za sve ono sto im je bilo nepoznato (bog mora, bog sunca itd...), da bi kasnije imali samo jednog. Je li to rezultat stecenoga znanja, ili rezultat spustanja Kurana?

Inace, meni ne smeta sta god pises, i ne trebas se nikome izvinjavati za svoje misljenje. 10.gif

Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

03-19-2004 11:48 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

      citat od BiH:

    Evo mislim da je ovo bilo na temu 05.gif
    Izvinjavam se ako sam nekoga ugnjavio, meni je ovo bilo pravo zanimljivo.



BiH,

nije svaciji nivo znanja isti, pa prema tome ni interes za neke postove nam nije svima isti. Ti stvari vidis na svoj nacin, pa su ti i ova objasnjenja prihvatljiva. Medjutim ima dosta stvari koje mozda ne znas, a koje ove tvoje postove cine irelevantnim. Na primjer, jesi li znao da je NASA u laboratoriji napravila uslove slicne onima u svemiru, i u takvim uslovima napravila primitivne celije koje oponasaju membranske strukture nadjene u svim zivim organizmima, a samim tim znaci da su (mozda) uticale i na nastanak zivota. Ovo sto je uradjeno nije slucajnost, nego je rezultat znanja i hemijskih reakcija. Opet ovu raspravu nekako skreces na tumacenje Kurana, pa mi nije jasno sta ocekujes kao rezultat rasprave. 14.gif

Thread: Vjerujete li u male zelene?
airuno

Replies: 85
Views: 4152

03-12-2004 09:03 Forum: NAUKA

Poruka iz komsiluka:

Thread: Josip Broz Tito
airuno

Replies: 601
Views: 18208

03-10-2004 09:10 Forum: ISTORIJA / POVIJEST

      citat od celmica:

    ...

    aurino, je l' to imas nesto protiv Sarajlija?!?



Boze sacuvaj! Pola mi je familije u Sarajevu, a i sam sam proveo naljepse godine (studentske) u Sarajevu. Ono sto mi smeta je Sarajevska politika, koja ne vidi dalje od onih granica koje sam ti gore spomenuo.

A kada se bolje zivjelo, to neka svak vidi za sebe. Meni je drago da si ti sretna sto zivis u boljem sistemu nego sto smo mi prije tebe, u drustvu motivisanih, skolovanih i postenih radnika, nacionalno osvjescenih, finansijski zbrinutih, koji idu u penziju sretni i spokojni. Vama su granice svih drzava otvorene, vize vam ne trebaju, a kako vidim i zdravstvo vam je na zavidnom nivou. Ne kontam samo kako nas onda citav svijet vidi na dnu liste civilizovanih zemalja.

Thread: jeste li znali ...
airuno

Replies: 96
Views: 5315

03-06-2004 12:33 Forum: KULTURA

Saturn je jedina planeta u nasem suncevom sistemu cija je gustina manja od vode. Kada bi se mogao napraviti dovoljno veliki bazen, Saturn bi plivao.

Thread: Testirajte Vas Mozak (i naucite nesto usput)
airuno

Replies: 29
Views: 1381

Testirajte Vas Mozak (i naucite nesto usput) 03-06-2004 11:04 Forum: NAUKA

Vjezbe za mozak...

    http://www.youramazingbrain.org/



a evo i prevodioca na jos neke jezike...

    http://dictionary.reference.com/translate/text.html

Thread: Ineresantni Dokazi....
airuno

Replies: 81
Views: 3222

03-06-2004 04:32 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

Evo da vas ateista pocasti slikama dokaza ...

    http://www.yanabi.com/activeweb.cfm?a_id=732

Thread: Optical Illusions
airuno

Replies: 41
Views: 2301

03-05-2004 08:35 Forum: NAUKA

Gledaj u sivu tacku u sredini, koja trepce. Ove zelene tacke ce onda poceti da nestaju...

Thread: Optical Illusions
airuno

Replies: 41
Views: 2301

03-05-2004 08:31 Forum: NAUKA

Always upstairs

Thread: Saljive slike
airuno

Replies: 2609
Views: 195390

03-05-2004 08:26 Forum: LISKALUCI

.

Thread: Josip Broz Tito
airuno

Replies: 601
Views: 18208

03-02-2004 07:40 Forum: ISTORIJA / POVIJEST

      citat od celmica:


    ... samo sto sad' imam nacionalni identitet.



Nek vala imas nacionalni identitet, pa taman nam pola drzave skapalo od gladi!
Vama sarajlijama je B i H svakako od Bascarsije do Skenderije. Vidjecemo kako cete zivjeti
kad vam sadaka prestane stizati u Sarajevo.

Thread: Ineresantni Dokazi....
airuno

Replies: 81
Views: 3222

02-28-2004 13:12 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

201 23:65 67 !alyawma
202 23:100 102 yawmi
203 23:101 103 yawma^'i&i~ that day
204 23:111 113 !alyawma
205 23:113 115 yawma~!
206 23:113 115 yawmi~ part of a day
207 24:2 2 wa!lyawmi
208 24:24 24 yawma
209 24:25 25 yawma^'i&i~ that day
210 24:37 37 yawma~!
211 24:64 64 wayawma
212 25:14 15 !alyawma
213 25:17 18 wayawma
214 25:22 24 yawma
215 25:22 24 yawma^'i&i~ that day
216 25:24 26 yawma^'i&i~ that day
217 25:25 27 wayawma
218 25:26 28 yawma^'i&i~ that day
219 25:26 28 yawma~!
220 25:27 29 wayawma
221 25:59 60 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
222 25:69 69 yawma
223 26:38 37 yawmi~
224 26:82 82 yawma
225 26:87 87 yawma
226 26:88 88 yawma
227 26:135 135 yawmi~
228 26:155 155 yawmi~
229 26:156 156 yawmi~
230 26:189 189 yawmi
231 26:189 189 yawmi~
232 27:83 85 wayawma
233 27:87 89 wayawma
234 27:89 91 yawma^'i&i~ that day
235 28:41 41 wayawma
236 28:42 42 wayawma
237 28:61 61 yawma
238 28:62 62 wayawma
239 28:65 65 wayawma
240 28:66 66 yawma^'i&i~ that day
241 28:71 71 yawmi
242 28:72 72 yawmi
243 28:74 74 wayawma
244 29:13 12 yawma
245 29:25 24 yawma
246 29:36 35 !alyawma
247 29:55 55 yawma
248 30:4 3 wayawma^'i&i~ that day
249 30:12 11 wayawma
250 30:14 13 wayawma
251 30:14 13 yawma^'i&i~ that day
252 30:43 42 yawmu~
253 30:43 42 yawma^'i&i~ that day
254 30:55 54 wayawma
255 30:56 56 yawmi
256 30:56 56 yawmu
257 30:57 57 fayawma^'i&i~ that day
258 31:33 32 yawma~!
259 32:4 3 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
260 32:5 4 yawmi~
261 32:14 14 yawmikum your day
262 32:25 25 yawma
263 32:29 29 yawma
264 33:21 21 wa!lyawma
265 33:44 43 yawma
266 33:66 66 yawma
267 34:18 17 wa-'ayya!ma~! days
268 34:30 29 yawmi~
269 34:40 39 wayawma
270 34:42 41 fa!lyawma
271 35:14 15 wayawma
272 36:54 54 fa!lyawma
273 36:55 55 !alyawma
274 36:59 59 !alyawma
275 36:64 64 !alyawma
276 36:65 65 !alyawma
277 37:20 20 yawmu
278 37:21 21 yawmu
279 37:26 26 !alyawma
280 37:33 32 yawma^'i&i~ that day
281 37:144 144 yawmi
282 38:16 15 yawmi
283 38:26 25 yawma
284 38:53 53 liyawmi
285 38:78 79 yawmi
286 38:79 80 yawmi
287 38:81 82 yawmi
288 39:13 15 yawmi~
289 39:15 17 yawma
290 39:24 25 yawma
291 39:31 32 yawma
292 39:47 48 yawma
293 39:60 61 wayawma
294 39:67 67 yawma
295 39:71 71 yawmikum your day
296 40:9 9 yawma^'i&i~ that day
297 40:15 15 yawma
298 40:16 16 yawma F: yawmahum
299 40:16 16 !alyawma
300 40:17 17 !alyawma today
301 40:17 17 !alyawma today
302 40:18 18 yawma
303 40:27 28 biyawmi
304 40:29 30 !alyawma
305 40:30 31 yawmi
306 40:32 34 yawma
307 40:33 35 yawma
308 40:46 49 wayawma
309 40:49 52 yawma~!
310 40:51 54 wayawma
311 40:52 55 yawma
312 41:9 8 yawmayni 2days
313 41:10 9 -'ayya!mi~ 4days
314 41:12 11 yawmayni 2days
315 41:16 15 -'ayya!mi~ days
316 41:19 18 wayawma
317 41:40 40 yawma
318 41:47 47 wayawma
319 42:7 5 yawma
320 42:45 44 yawma
321 42:47 46 yawmu~
322 42:47 46 yawma^'i&i~ that day
323 43:39 38 !alyawma
324 43:65 65 yawmi~
325 43:67 67 yawma^'i&i~ that day
326 43:68 68 !alyawma
327 43:83 83 yawmahum
328 44:10 9 yawma
329 44:16 15 yawma
330 44:40 40 yawma
331 44:41 41 yawma
332 45:14 13 -'ayya!ma days
333 45:17 16 yawma
334 45:26 25 yawmi
335 45:27 26 wayawma
336 45:27 26 yawma^'i&i~
337 45:28 27 !alyawma
338 45:34 33 !alyawma
339 45:34 33 yawmikum your day
340 45:35 34 fa!lyawma
341 46:5 4 yawmi
342 46:20 19 wayawma
343 46:20 19 fa!lyawma today
344 46:21 20 yawmi~
345 46:34 33 wayawma
346 46:35 34 yawma
347 50:20 19 yawmu
348 50:22 21 !alyawma
349 50:30 29 yawma
350 50:34 33 yawmu
351 50:38 37 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
352 50:41 40 yawma
353 50:42 41 yawma
354 50:42 41 yawmu missing in F
355 50:44 43 yawma
356 51:12 12 yawmu
357 51:13 13 yawma
358 51:60 60 yawmihim that day of theirs
359 52:9 9 yawma
360 52:11 11 yawma^'i&i~ that day
361 52:13 13 yawma
362 52:45 45 yawmahum
363 52:46 46 yawma
364 54:6 6 yawma
365 54:8 8 yawmu~
366 54:19 19 yawmi
367 54:48 48 yawma
368 55:29 29 yawmi~
369 55:39 39 fayawma^'i&i~ that day
370 56:50 50 yawmi~
371 56:56 56 yawma
372 57:4 4 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
373 57:12 12 yawma
374 57:12 12 !alyawma
375 57:13 13 yawma
376 57:15 14 fa!lyawma
377 58:6 7 yawma
378 58:7 8 yawma
379 58:18 19 yawma
380 58:22 22 wa!lyawmi
381 60:3 3 yawma
382 60:6 6 wa!lyawma
383 62:9 9 yawmi missing in F
384 64:9 9 yawmu
385 64:9 9 liyawmi
386 64:9 9 yawma
387 65:2 2 wa!lyawmi
388 66:7 7 !alyawma
389 66:8 8 yawma
390 68:24 24 !alyawma
391 68:39 39 yawmi
392 68:42 42 yawma
393 69:7 7 -'ayya!mi~ 8days
394 69:15 15 fayawma^'i&i~ that day
395 69:16 16 yawma^'i&i~ that day
396 69:17 17 yawma^'i&i~ that day
397 69:18 18 yawma^'i&i~ that day
398 69:24 24 !l-'ayya!mi days
399 69:35 35 !alyawma
400 70:4 4 yawmi~
401 70:8 8 yawma
402 70:11 11 yawma^'i&i~ that day
403 70:26 26 biyawmi
404 70:42 42 yawmahum that day of theirs
405 70:43 43 yawma
406 70:44 44 !lyawmu
407 73:14 14 yawma
408 73:17 17 yawma~!
409 74:9 9 yawma^'i&i~ that day
410 74:9 9 yawmu~
411 74:46 47 biyawmi
412 75:1 1 biyawmi
413 75:6 6 yawmu
414 75:10 10 yawma^'i&i~ that day
415 75:12 12 yawma^'i&i~ that day
416 75:13 13 yawma^'i&i~ that day
417 75:22 22 yawma^'i&i~ that day
418 75:24 24 yawma^'i&i~ that day
419 75:30 30 yawma^'i&i~ that day
420 76:7 7 yawma~!
421 76:10 10 yawma~!
422 76:11 11 !lyawmi that day
423 76:27 27 yawma~!
424 77:12 12 yawmi~
425 77:13 13 liyawmi
426 77:14 14 yawmu
427 77:15 15 yawma^'i&i~ that day
428 77:19 19 yawma^'i&i~ that day
429 77:24 24 yawma^'i&i~ that day
430 77:28 28 yawma^'i&i~ that day
431 77:34 34 yawma^'i&i~ that day
432 77:35 35 yawmu
433 77:37 37 yawma^'i&i~ that day
434 77:38 38 yawmu
435 77:40 40 yawma^'i&i~ that day
436 77:45 45 yawma^'i&i~ that day
437 77:47 47 yawma^'i&i~ that day
438 77:49 49 yawma^'i&i~ that day
439 78:17 17 yawma
440 78:18 18 yawma
441 78:38 38 yawma
442 78:39 39 !lyawmu
443 78:40 41 yawma
444 79:6 6 yawma
445 79:8 8 yawma^'i&i~ that day
446 79:35 35 yawma
447 79:46 46 yawma
448 80:34 34 yawma
449 80:37 37 yawma^'i&i~ that day
450 80:38 38 yawma^'i&i~ that day
451 80:40 40 yawma^'i&i~ that day
452 82:15 15 yawma
453 82:17 17 yawmu missing in F
454 82:18 18 yawmu
455 82:19 19 yawma
456 82:19 19 yawma^'i&i~ that day
457 83:5 5 liyawmi~
458 83:6 6 yawma
459 83:10 10 yawma^'i&i~ that day
460 83:11 11 biyawmi
461 83:15 15 yawma^'i&i~ that day
462 83:34 34 fa!lyawma
463 85:2 2 wa!lyawmi
464 86:9 9 yawma
465 88:2 2 yawma^'i&i~ that day
466 88:8 8 yawma^'i&i~ that day
467 89:23 24 yawma^'i&i~ that day
468 89:23 24 yawma^'i&i~ that day
469 89:25 25 fayawma^'i&i~ that day
470 90:14 14 yawmi~
471 99:4 4 yawma^'i&i~ that day
472 99:6 6 yawma^'i&i~ that day
473 100:11 11 yawma^'i&i~ that day
474 101:4 3 yawma
475 102:8 8 yawma^'i&i~ that day

Unusual transliteration symbols:
~ nunates the previous vowel
! is alif, and also hamzat-ul-wasl
- is alif as a chair for hamza
' is hamza
& is dhal
^ is a point (used with hamza)

Thread: Ineresantni Dokazi....
airuno

Replies: 81
Views: 3222

02-28-2004 12:59 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

ALL MENTIONS OF ANY FORM OF "YAWIMA" IN THE QUR'AN

"verse" is the standard verse number.
"F#" is the verse number from Flugel's concordance and
Qur'an.
"form" gives my own transliteration of the Arabic form. This
is non-standard, but standard transliteration does not
fully convey Arabic writing, only pronunciation, more
or less. Transliteration notes are at the end.
"trans" is a rough translation of some words; also some
mentions of "day" give a specific number, which is
shown.

verse F# form trans notes
1 1:04 3 yawmi
2 2:08 7 wabi!lyawmi
3 2:48 45 yawma~!
4 2:62 59 wa!lyawmi
5 2:80 74 -'ayya!ma~! days
6 2:85 79 wayawma
7 2:113 107 yawma
8 2:123 117 yawma~!
9 2:126 120 wa!lyawmi
10 2:174 169 yawma
11 2:177 172 wa!lyawmi
12 2:184 180 -'ayya!ma~! days
13 2:184 180 -'ayya!mi~ days
14 2:185 181 -'ayya!mi~ days
15 2:196 192 -'ayya!mi~ 3days
16 2:203 199 -'ayya!mi~ days
17 2:203 199 yawmayni 2days
18 2:212 208 yawma
19 2:228 228 wa!lyawmi
20 2:232 232 wa!lyawmi
21 2:249 250 !alyawma
22 2:254 255 yawmu~
23 2:259 261 yawma~!
24 2:259 261 yawmi~ part of a day
25 2:264 266 wa!lyawmi
26 2:281 281 yawma~!
27 3:09 7 liyawmi~
28 3:24 23 -'ayya!ma~! days
29 3:25 24 liyawmi~
30 3:30 28 yawma
31 3:41 36 -'ayya!mi~ 3days
32 3:55 48 yawmi
33 3:77 71 yawma
34 3:106 102 yawma
35 3:114 110 wa!lyawmi
36 3:140 134 !al-'ayya!mu days
37 3:155 149 yawma
38 3:161 155 yawma
39 3:166 160 yawma
40 3:167 160 yawma^'i&i~ that day
41 3:180 176 yawma
42 3:185 182 yawma
43 3:194 192 yawma
44 4:38 42 bi!lyawmi
45 4:39 43 wa!lyawmi
46 4:42 45 yawma^'i&i~ that day
47 4:59 62 wa!lyawmi
48 4:87 89 yawmi
49 4:109 109 yawma
50 4:136 135 wa!lyawmi
51 4:141 140 yawma
52 4:159 157 wayawma
53 4:162 160 wa!lyawmi
54 5:03 4 !alyawma
55 5:03 5 !alyawma
56 5:05 7 !alyawma
57 5:14 17 yawmi
58 5:36 40 yawmi
59 5:64 69 yawmi
60 5:69 73 wa!lyawmi
61 5:89 91 -'ayya!mi~ 3days
62 5:109 108 yawma
63 5:119 119 yawmu
64 6:12 12 yawmi
65 6:15 15 yawmi~
66 6:16 16 yawma^'i&i~ that day
67 6:22 22 wayawma
68 6:73 72 wayawma
69 6:73 73 yawma
70 6:93 93 !alyawma
71 6:128 128 wayawma
72 6:130 130 yawmikum
73 6:141 142 yawma
74 6:158 159 yawma
75 7:08 7 yawma^'i&i~ that day
76 7:14 13 yawmi
77 7:32 30 yawma
78 7:51 49 fa!lyawma today
79 7:51 49 yawmihim
80 7:53 51 yawma
81 7:54 52 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
82 7:59 57 yawmi~
83 7:163 163 yawma
84 7:163 163 wayawma
85 7:167 166 yawmi
86 7:172 171 yawma
87 8:16 16 yawma^'i&i~
88 8:41 42 yawma
89 8:41 42 yawma
90 8:48 50 !alyawma
91 9:03 3 yawma
92 9:18 18 wa!lyawmi
93 9:19 19 wa!lyawmi
94 9:25 25 wayawma
95 9:29 29 bi!lyawmi
96 9:35 35 yawma
97 9:36 36 yawma
98 9:44 44 wa!lyawmi
99 9:45 45 wa!lyawmi
100 9:77 78 yawmi
101 9:99 100 wa!lyawmi
102 9:108 109 yawmi~
103 10:03 3 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
104 10:15 16 yawmi~
105 10:28 29 wayawma
106 10:45 46 wayawma
107 10:60 61 yawma
108 10:92 92 fa!lyawma
109 10:93 93 yawma
110 10:102 102 -'ayya!mi days
111 11:03 3 yawmi~
112 1:40 9 -'ayya!mi~ 6days
113 11:08 11 yawma
114 11:26 28 yawmi~
115 11:43 45 !alyawma
116 11:60 63 wayawma
117 11:65 68 -'ayya!mi~ 3days
118 11:66 69 yawma^'i&i~ that day
119 11:77 79 yawmu~
120 11:84 85 yawmi~
121 11:98 100 yawma
122 11:99 101 wayawma
123 11:103 105 yawmu~
124 11:103 105 yawmu~
125 11:105 107 yawma
126 12:54 54 !alyawma
127 12:92 92 !alyawma
128 1:12 5 bi-'ayya!mi days
129 14:18 21 yawmi~
130 14:31 36 yawmu~
131 14:41 42 yawma
132 14:42 43 liyawmi~
133 14:44 44 yawma
134 14:48 49 yawma
135 14:49 50 yawma^'i&i~ that day
136 15:35 35 yawmi
137 15:36 36 yawmi
138 15:38 38 yawmi
139 16:25 27 yawma
140 16:27 29 yawma
141 16:27 29 !alyawma
142 16:63 65 !alyawma
143 16:80 82 yawma
144 16:80 82 wayawma
145 16:84 86 wayawma
146 16:87 89 yawma^'i&i~ that day
147 16:89 91 wayawma
148 16:92 94 yawma
149 16:111 112 yawma
150 16:124 125 yawma
151 17:13 14 yawma
152 17:14 15 !alyawma
153 17:52 54 yawma
154 17:58 60 yawmi
155 17:62 64 yawmi
156 17:71 73 yawma
157 17:97 99 yawma
158 18:19 18 yawma~!
159 18:19 18 yawmi~ part of a day
160 18:47 45 wayawma
161 18:52 50 wayawma
162 18:99 99 yawma^'i&i~ that day
163 18:100 100 yawma^'i&i~ that day
164 18:105 105 yawma
165 19:15 15 yawma
166 19:15 15 wayawma
167 19:15 15 wayawma
168 19:26 27 !alyawma
169 19:33 34 yawma
170 19:33 34 wayawma
171 19:33 34 wayawma
172 19:37 38 yawmi~
173 19:38 39 yawma
174 19:38 39 !alyawma
175 19:39 40 yawma
176 19:85 88 yawma
177 19:95 95 yawma
178 20:59 61 yawmu
179 20:64 67 !alyawma
180 20:100 100 yawma
181 20:101 101 yawma
182 20:102 102 yawma
183 20:102 102 yawma^'i&i~ that day
184 20:104 104 yawma~!
185 20:108 107 yawma^'i&i~ that day
186 20:109 108 yawma^'i&i~ that day
187 20:124 124 yawma
188 20:126 126 !alyawma
189 21:47 48 liyawmi
190 21:103 103 yawmukum your day
191 21:104 104 yawma
192 22:02 2 yawma
193 22:09 9 yawma
194 22:17 17 yawma
195 22:28 29 -'ayya!mi~ days
196 22:47 46 yawma~!
197 22:55 54 yawmi~
198 22:56 55 yawma^'i&i~ that day
199 22:69 68 yawma
200 23:16 16 yawma

Thread: Ineresantni Dokazi....
airuno

Replies: 81
Views: 3222

02-28-2004 12:57 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

ON THE CLAIM THAT
THE WORD "DAY" OCCURS IN THE QUR'AN 365 TIMES

by AbdulraHman Lomax,

    marjan@gate.ioa.com


[Corrected 2/22/96]

as-salamu 'alaykum

It is the wont of the followers and imitators of Rashad
Khalifa to claim this or that numerical phenomenon in the
Qur'an as a "miracle." In spite of repeated invitations,
they have never defined precisely what they mean by
"miracle," but the apparent meaning is any striking
congruity of numbers derived from the Qur'an, or sometimes
from other sources like the numerical values of the letters
in Rashad Khalifa's name.

When word counts are involved, I have often found that the
counts have been manipulated, generally in unstated ways, to
produce the striking totals. This claim that the occurrence
of the word "day" (yawm) in the Qur'an is 365 is an example.

Edip Yuksel wrote:

> Below is the frequency of the word "Yawm" day (in its
> singular form) in the Quran. I have copied from one of my
> Turkish books. Unfortunately, during the transfer it lost
> its format.

Notice that Yuksel did qualify the statement, unlike the
earlier mentions of this "miracle" in the newsgroup
soc.religion.islam. He is only counting singular forms. Now,
if it were necessary to count the dual and plural forms of
the word to come up with the "miraculous" total, I am
certain that they would have been included. Nevertheless, it
would be interesting if all occurrences of the singular
"day" in the Qur'an totalled 365. Do they?

I have seen this claim before. Then, I looked up "yawm" in
the Kassis concordance, and found 475 mentions. However,
this included the dual and plural forms, and it is a piece
of work to separate them out. But now Yuksel has presented
us with a list, albeit mangled, of his claimed "singular
forms." Further, I just obtained a copy of the Flugel
concordance, which lists each unique form in superb detail.
So, I was moved to check this claim out more precisely.

I took Yuksel's list, formatted it, and imported it into a
database program. Then I used the Kassis concordance to
insert all mentions of the word, including the dual and
plural. Since Kassis, conveniently, gives the verse numbers
from Flugel's edition of the Qur'an in addition to the more
standard numbers used by Khalifa, I was able to identify
each form without the more tedious work of looking up each
verse. In the process, initially, I found several misprints
in Yuksel's list, plus tabulation errors, as well as three
occurrences missing from Flugel [and one misidentification].
I did not find any errors in Kassis. Note, however, that I
do not have a validated Arabic Qur'an in machine-readable
form. It is possible, but highly unlikely, that there are
additional mentions not listed in Kassis.

The finished database is appended below for anyone who
wishes to examine the data.

Of the 475 total occurrences of all forms of "yawm," 3 are
in the dual and 27 are in the plural, leaving 445 in the
singular.

Flugel's concordance lists 34 different forms of this word,
including variations caused by prefixes or suffixes. Here is
a list of these forms, with the total count for each form.
The number at the beginning of each row is the sequence of
the form in Flugel. Transliteration notes are at the end of
this article. Yuksel's count is given as corrected. The "<"
notes singular forms which Yuksel does not count.

F. form total Yuksel notes
20 !al-'ayya!mu 1 0 the days
16 !alyawma 38 38 the day
24 !l-'ayya!mi 1 0 the days
9 !lyawmi 1 1 the day
3 !lyawmu 2 2 the day
25 -'ayya!ma 1 0 days
26 -'ayya!ma~! 3 0 days
21 -'ayya!mi 1 0 days
23 -'ayya!mi~ 18 0 days
10 bi!lyawmi 2 2 by the day
22 bi-'ayya!mi 1 0 by the days
5 biyawmi 5 5 by a day
17 fa!lyawma 8 8 and the day
33 fayawma^'i&i~ 4 0 and that day
6 liyawmi 4 4 of a day
8 liyawmi~ 4 4 of a day
18 wa!lyawma 2 2 and the day
12 wa!lyawmi 21 21 and the day
27 wa-'ayya!ma~! 1 0 and days
11 wabi!lyawmi 1 1 and by the day
14 wayawma 44 44 and a day
34 wayawma^'i&i~ 1 0 and that day <
13 yawma 133 133 a day
32 yawma^'i&i~ 65 0 that day <
15 yawma~! 16 16 a day
31 yawmahum 3 0 their day <
19 yawmayni 3 0 2 days
4 yawmi 31 31 a day
7 yawmi~ 28 28 a day
30 yawmihim 2 0 their day <
29 yawmikum 4 0 your day <
1 yawmu 16 16 a day
2 yawmu~ 9 9 a day
28 yawmukum 1 0 your day <
TOTALS 475 365

Yuksel's originally published list was inaccurate, with
about six errors; it was not merely poorly formatted. But
this is water under the bridge. It is now possible to
determine how he and others came up with a count of 365
days. All the dual (3 mentions) and plural forms (27
mentions) are discarded; all forms with suffixes are
discarded, whether they be personal pronouns (10 mentions)
or 'idhin ("that") (70 mentions), except that the suffixed
alif of the accusative does not exclude the word. This
brings the total down to 365 mentions. But note that 80
clearly singular forms have been omitted.

I would appreciate notice of any substantive errors in this
article, to
    marjan@gate.ioa.com
.

Thread: Saljive slike
airuno

Replies: 2609
Views: 195390

02-20-2004 10:59 Forum: LISKALUCI

Found Nemo!

Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

02-20-2004 09:05 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

      citat od zlatan:

    Isto tako se moze reci da sve sto su naucnici otkrili do sada nije donjelo ni jedan dokaz da Bog ne postoji ...



Nauka ide u suprotnom smijeru. Uzme REZULTAT pa ga dokazuje. Nauka je do sada dokazala da mnoge tvrdnje iz religioznih knjiga nemaju NAUCNOG osnova, sto znaci da one mogu biti tacne za VJERNIKE kojima materijalni dokazi nisu potrebni da bi vjerovali u to u sta oni vjeruju. Cilj nauke nije da dokaze da nema boga, vec da NAUCNO odgovori na pitanja o ... svacemu!

Thread: *** ima li boga ***
airuno

Replies: 2434
Views: 91718

02-20-2004 08:52 Forum: RELIGIJA, FILOZOFIJA I PSIHOLOGIJA

Zlatane, nisam ni jedno ni drugo, ali sam slucajno procitao o ovome, pa da ti odgovorim...


Kriscani pocinju jesti svinjetinu negdje oko 50. godine poslije nove ere. Iako i biblija zabranjuje, oko ovoga doba pocinje se vjerovati da se ova zabrana odnosi samo na zidove (nakon sto je sveti petar imao viziju da je bog ocistio sve zivotinje i ucinio ih podobnim za ljudsku upotrebu).

Interesantno je da je i u jednoj staroj kineskoj knjizi (prije 3000 godina) napisano da ljudi ne smiju jesti svinjetinu.

Inace moderna nauka prihvata ove zabrane kao razumne - za ono vrijeme, s obzirom da svinje imaju predispoziciju prenosa raznih bolesti, virusa, crvica, kao i nekih otrova u mesu, vise nego druge zivotinje.

Ja inace ne jedem svinjetinu (vise). 21.gif

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